It is a software load and new software will be installed soon that looks at both AOAs instead of a single source,and yes it has been encountered by loin air the night before the first crash, the flight crew encountered uncommanded nose down trim and requested to return to the point of origin but was able to get the aircraft under control by using the stab trim cutout,they continued the flight and the AOA vane was changed that night,the originating flight the next morning experienced the same issue and crashed.
It should be noted that mcas is inhibited any time the flaps are not full up,which would be any approach,and will inhabit for 5 seconds anytime stab trim is commanded from the yoke,it is my understanding that most of these problems are encountered on climb out when the flaps are raised to full up from the flaps one position that is normally used for takeoff.

Personally, I'm not a fan of dummy-proofing things for someone with extensive training like a pilot for a major airline. Dummy-proofing for your average driver on I-30 during rush hour - sure. For a pilot who is required to have thousands of hours of experience and tons of hours of training, and setting it up so that you have computers over-riding pilot inputs but not telling the pilots about the over-ride, that's a problem. I think if they were going to add this system, there should be a warning light in the instrument panel to show when it's activated.

It was created, in theory, to avoid something like the Air France 447 disaster where the pilot stalled the aircraft into the ocean. But I'm just not sure that trimming down is even the right approach in that situation unless the system is also going to reverse the trim as soon as the AOA is in the very early stages of being corrected. If you don't, then you're just going to have airplanes being flown into the ground like we've been watching.

I guess all in all, I think it's a poorly designed system that should be disabled until they can figure out a smarter way to implement it.

Sounding like the accidents may be pilot/training error?

I ws on a flight, pilot came on said we had a small window between a storm to land. I would have sworn we were going straight down to instant death.

Try landing on Maui. Fly over Haliakala at about 12,000 feet, then dive for the runway at the foot of the mountain. It�ll get your attention.

That's always what the aircraft manufacturer is going to say.

You shouldn't design an automated system that requires pilot input to avoid from crashing.

But, but, that is what pilots are trained to do. So they should do it when they have to, not let the pile of metal plummet to earth.

I don�t write programs for aviation controls. But if I did write what that pushed the nose down to avoid a stall I think I would also write one that I disengaged that feature under a certain altitude.

I have no idea why anyone would do that...and I have flown into Maui many times.

Simply go around the west Maui mountains, let down, overfly the Island of Lanai...straight in .

Easy.

Why anyone would overfly a 10,000 foot mountain when there is a 5000� mountain a few miles away is beyond me.

Boeing has had a rough week. 737 Max issue and I saw yesterday where the AF was ringing them up on FOD in newly delivered tankers....

Guess they don't practice what they preach on the FOD side since I've been a Boeing sub and they have no issue tearing vendors a new one over it.

I'm from an aviation family. This is an interesting issue and the explanation of the systems by E8C are amazing.

Through experience and connections, I understand why planes like the 737-X have the software they do. Same as Airbus. The global demand for air travel exceeds the talent pool of pilots. 99% of the time, the plane systems work fine and cover for newbie pilots.

The recent downed airliner had a Captain with 2,000 hours and a First Officer with 500 fresh out of the aviation academy. A consultant with experience on the Today show this morning mentioned that there exists over-rides (see E8C posts) but if pilots aren't even trained to know where they are...well, that's not an equipment issue, that's a training issue. For many years I've heard that cockpit management and straight stick-and-yoke flying are difficult for different cultures.

American Airlines has been flying 737 Max class since November 2017. US Aviation is statistically incredible. Considering the outdated, non-funded system upgrades we need for the Air Traffic Control systems (real heroes right there), our pilots are the best in the world. Go to a different continent, fly some other airline, roll the dice.

New info out: Human error in both accidents.

The Lion Air crash was totally preventable. The day before the crash a deadheading pilot in the cockpit saved that crew from a crash by showing them how to correct the runaway stab trim problem. They landed safely. The cause was a defective AOA vent. Did they write it up to tell maintenance and future pilots? NO! It also looks like Lion air was saving money by buying after market parts from a salvage yard in Florida.

Trips...talked to one of my friends. He�s a CA at SWA.

He says the grounding is bogus. Pilot error. We had a stick pusher in the eurotrash (F100) I was on....kinda the same deal.

I agree having flown Aeromexico, Air Mexican, Aeroflot and Lufthansa. No bad flights but it makes you wonder. From talking with some of my friends they have had some really interesting flights.

I wish I could show you pics of ours Max8 aircraft but company policy prevents that, but the ones in dal are totally sealed up for long term storage,I don�t think they will fly again until new software is installed,and Boeing will have to get the new software approved before they send it out to the airlines,the last 10 or so aircraft we took delivery of have duel AOA displays on the DUs for the pilots to compare them but the stall management computer currently only looks at the #1 AOA, it�s my understanding that the new software will inhibit mcas if the AOAs are more than a degree or so from each other.
I think that the 737 has just about reached its upper limits based on the current design and Boeing needs to either bring back the 757 or design something similar for the single isle mid range market that the A 321 NEO is currently dominating.